Katherine Collins (unknown), widow Allen - Katherine Collins (widow Allen)

Don I would like to tag some of the people you mentioned
You said " George Allen of Sandwich's George Allen, of Sandwich son Matthew Matthew Allen, of Dartmouth was the son-in-law of my Sandwich-Dartmouth, Mass. ancestors (Mathew was married to Sarah Allen )

" The claim that George's son James was one and the same as James Allen of Tisbury, Mass. is erroneous, the latter James being the son-in-law of my ancestors, George and Sarah (Tracy) Partrich of Duxbury, Mass., the latter's daughter Ruth being my ancestor.

I cannot find a son of George of Sandwich named James

"the latter James being the son-in-law of my ancestors, George and Sarah (Tracy) Partrich of Duxbury, Mass., the latter's daughter Ruth being my ancestor.

I found a profile for George Partridge George Partridge, of Duxbury and his wife Sarah (Tracy) Partridge Sarah Partridge their daughter Elizabeth Allen was married to James Allen of Chilmark his parents were Samuel Allen, of Braintree and Ann Allen, of Braintree

In Geni it shows Ruth Partridge Ruth Thacher married to Rev. Rhodolphus Thacher

Really appreciate you joining this discussion

I am away for a vacation so I will reply to these in September. I don't have my files here.

Clarification. Anderson's GMB sketch of George Allen of Sandwich includes discussion of several persons (Francis Allen, James Allen, etc) for which no evidence exists that they were the sons of the immigrant George Allen. Despite this, many people have attached a son James Allen to George or to George's son Samuel. However, Anderson did not go far enough regarding this James Allen in the sketch. Said James was the son of Samuel Allen of Braintree, Mass. with James' wife being Elizabeth Partridge, the daughter of George Patridge and Sarah Tracy of Duxbury, Mass. After James and Elizabeth's first four children were born on record (VRs) in Sandwich, James was one of the founders of the town of Tisbury on Martha's Vineyard (Dukes County, Mass.) where borth died with still standing gravestones.

Matthew Allen, son of George and his last wife Katherine (unknown) married Sarah Kirby of record (Plym. Colony and Sandwich MM Records) on June 6, 1657, daughter of Richard and Jane Kirby of Sandwich and last of Dartmouth, Mass. Sarah (Kirby) Allen's younger sister Ruhamah (Kirby) Smith is my ancestor. Matthew was named an executor of his brother-in-law John Smith's will and estate at Dartmouth (my ancestor), but by the time Smith's estate was probated Matthew Allen was dead.

Concerning Francis Allen of Sandwich, he was first mentioned in 1643 (List of those able to bear arms in Plymouth in 1643 includes Thomas Allen in Scittuate; George, Raph, Francis and Mathew Allen in Sandwich; and Thomas Allen in Barnstable, The New England Historic and Genealogical Register, Boston, MA, v. 4, p. 255-259). But as you say, there is no evidence that Francis was related to George. On the other hand, both Francis and Jedediah Allen (son of Ralph (Stonemason) Allen, Jr.) both had land in the "The Lots" in the 1667 survey of the land (Sandwich, A Cape Cod Town, R. A. Lovell, Jr., Town of Sandwich Massachusetts Archives and Historical Center, 1996; also Sandwich Proprietors records, 1656-1680, transcript made 30 Sep 1869 because of deterioration of originals, Family History Llibrary film 0904584, item 1, and Sandwich Proprietors records, 1656-1680, originals film 0904584, item 2). Of the 4 lots that he had, 3 are bounded by Jedediah Allen. There were no other Allens in that area in the 1667 survey. So, although the evidence is poor, this might suggest that Francis was related to Jedediah son of Ralph Jr., rather than George Allen. The evidence suggests that there were three early Allens in Sandwich who were related, but not related to George. The three include Ralph (Stonemason) Allen, Jr., John Allen who married Elizabeth Bacon in 1650 and moved to Newport, RI, and Francis. Jedediah's will in NJ bequeathed some land to Mary Allen granddaughter of John Allen of Newport, supporting the idea that Jedediah was related to John.

Thanks Richardson. Jedediah, son of Ralph (stonemason) Allen, is likely my ancestor if I am able to separate and clearly document several confusing Quaker marriages in western New Jersey in the early 18th century.

I am most active on Findagrave where I maintain the memorial for the immigrant George Allen and his last wife Katherine. It took me a month to consolidate five duplicate George Allen memorials into one, the other four claiming all manner of erroneous family associations. I repeatedly get suggestions to place George in the Sandwich Friends burial place in Sandwich, when George died many years before the first Friend (Quaker) ever arrived in New England. I also get repeated requests to claim George's last wife Katherine was nee Starkes, when the recorded marriage licence and actual marriage of a George Allen of London was to a Katherine "Slarke." Thus, the reason for my initial inquiry to this discussion regarding the evidence that George Allen of London who married said Katherine was associated with the Livery Company of London and never left England. If you would be so kind as to expand on the latter evidence I would greatly appreciate it.

I'm off to a doctor appointment, but I'll get back to you. Below is an old discussion in 1997:

As part of the ongoing work concerning the English origins of George Allen of Sandwich I've been looking at various data. One hypothesis I've recently been trying to document was published a few years ago concerning George & Katherine [Starkes or Slarkes] Allen. The hypothesis was published in: Guilford, J.S., 1990, The Ancestry of Dr. J.P. Guilford, Volume 1, Seventeenth Century New England Colonials: Sheridan Psychological Services, Inc., Orange, CA. The idea is presented in a single paragraph, apparently based entirely on an unpublished 1985 manuscript by Seward & Norah (Stewart) Allen of Florence AL, and lacks any references to primary sources. A quote follows:
"The first hypothesis was based on an assumption that George/1's second wife was Catherine Starkes, the marriage having taken place on November 4, 1624, at All Hallows Church in London [note: 5 Nov 1624, Katherine Slarkes according to both marriage license & marriage record]. This George Allen was a widower, the son of Richard Allen, a moneyer of the Tower of London, 24 years of age, and a clothworker by trade. Catherine was a spinster, 30 years of age or the year above and so was born by 1594. By 1635, at the time George/1 and Catherine are found listed as passengers to America, this George would have been 35 and his wife, 40 or 41. Our Catherine is listed then as age 30. It is known that George/1's earliest children were born shortly after 1600, making them contemporaries of this George. In essence, Guilford is presenting evidence that George & Katherine [Slarkes] Allen were not the same as George & Katherine Allen of Sandwich/etc. What I have been able to find so far is consistent with the above hypothesis, although the key evidence concerning the ages has not yet been found. The evidence found comprises several items:

1) from: W. Bruce Bannerman, 1915, The registers of St. Mary le Bowe, Cheapside, All Hallows, Honey Lane and of St. Pancras, Soper Lane, London. Part II, Marriages. Publications of the Harleian Society, Register Series, v. 45 8 Jan 1620[/1], Marriage Henry Allen of St. Michaels, Queenhithe, London, clothworker, & Susan Perry, late dau. of William Perry, clarke, deceased, by vtue of a lycence [All Hallows, Honey Lane, license not found] 5 Nov 1624, Marriage George Allen of London clothworker, and Katherin Slarkes of Woking, daughter of [blank] Slarkes of Woking in the County of Surre, by vertue of a lycence [All Hallows, Honey Lane]

2) from: Foster, Joseph (ed.), 1887, London Marriage Licences, 1521-1869, from excerpts by the late Colonel Chester. Bernard Quaritch, London Nov 4 1624, Marriage licence for George Allen of St. Michael Queenhithe, London, clothworker, and Katherine Slarks spinster daughter of ____ Slarke dec'd, at All Hallows, Honey Lane, London, Bishop of London.

3) from: Church wardens accounts, St. Michael Queenhithe, London, 1624-?, FHL Microfilm # 0571595 [note: no parish registers before 1653] 6 Oct 1624, Received of Henry Allen for the burial of his childe in the ch. yard [0/2/0] Jan 1627/8, Received of Henry Allen the remaynor of the ___engers Boake [4/0/0]

4) from: Dale, T.C., 1931, The inhabitants of London in 1638, v. 1. Society of Genealogists, London. FHL Microfilm # 1656404. 1638, Listing for St. Michael Queenhithe, Townsend Lane, includes Henry Allen, rent 4 pounds

5) from: Prerogative Court of Canterbury, wills 25 Sep 1620, Will of Richard Allen of "the Tower," dated 25 Sep 1620, mentions son Henry executor, lease at Ham, barn in Plastowe [Plaistow, both in co. Essex], sons George & John, wife Joane, witnesses __?__ Williams, Nicholas Rimbold, John Kinge, Roger ffawkenor. Probated 7 Nov 1620, admin. to son Henry [100 Soames] 1640, Will of Henry Allen of St. Michaell Queenhithe, clothworker, dated about 10 Apr 1640, nuncupative, to be buried in Chancel of church
tenements & lands in parish of Dealham in co. Bucks, of manor of Denham in co. Buck, bought of William Godman deceased, to six children of sister Susan Willmott wife Edmond Willmott, viz. William, Edward, Richard, George, Susan & Anne Willmott; forgives all debts from brother George Allen, unless said George takes over & refuses to surrender said tenements & lands in Burks to sister Susan, in which case debts to sister for her children, if necessary by legal action; bequest to Joseph ___[?], son of late sister Joane, of all interest in shopp & warehouse in Townesend Lane in St. Michael Queenhithe purchased of William Graves, Joseph to pay to testator's brother John Allen within six months 26 pounds, otherwise interest to executrix, she to pay brother John Allen, or if she refuses interest to brother John Allen; 10 pounds to poor of St. Michael Queenhith; 3 pounds to Mr Hill parson of parish for burial sermon; to Mr Glover ___ of parish 20 shillings; remainder after debts to wife Susan Allen; probate 1 Jun 1640 to "Susanna" Allen relict [83 Coventry]

6) from: parish register of St. Michael Queenhithe, London, 1653-1710, FHL Microfilm # 0374507 30 Mar 1664, Burial Georg Allen Shearsgrinder of this parish in the body of the church of St. Michael Queenhithe [St. Michael, Queenhithe]

7) from: Archdeaconry Court of London, Acts Books, v. 1-17, 1564-1700, FHL Microfilms # 0094462-0094467 May 1664, Probate of George Allen of St. Michael Queenhithe, dec'd intestate, 26: 3d mo[?], admin. to relict Sara Allen [Acts Books, v. 8, p. 85] Overall, the above data is consistent with two brothers, Henry & George, possibly sons of Richard Allen of the Tower of London, both married at All Hallows Honey Lane, both clothworkers resident in the parish of St. Michael Queenhithe, and both still resident in England in 1640 based on Henry's will. Whether the George Allen who died at St. Michael Queenhithe in 1664 is this same George is unclear, given the missing parish registers, but this is a distinct possibility.

The sources of the ages and the term "widower" for George, as mentioned by Guilford, are unclear. Neither appears in either the marriage license or the marriage record, so I'm uncertain where to look. Also, I haven't been able to find any records for this period from the manor of Denham, in Buckinghamshire, that mention either Henry or George, nor any records for Ham or Plaistow, in Essex, that mention these Allens. Finally, Richard their possible father was from the Tower of London, within the extra-parochial Tower Liberty district, and there thus appear to be no parish registers for this area and period.
Despite these problems, the hypothesis presented by Guilford seems to be panning out, at least so far. As a result, I would have to say that the identification of George & Katherine [Slarkes] Allen as George & Katherine Allen of Sandwich is questionable. I'll keep looking for additional data, but would welcome any suggestions for additional sources to check.