Was she a daughter of Sequoyah?

Started by Erica Howton on Monday, February 13, 2023
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Sa-ga-ha ‘Nancy’ Blackbird Is not listed by Jim Hicks at https://www.genealogy.com/ftm/h/i/c/James-R-Hicks-VA/BOOK-0001/0021..., but was entered on geni as a daughter of Sequoyah 'George Guess' Gist & Sarah "Sallie" Gist with Sallie’s parents as Daughter Wolf & unknown Waters (as per Hicks).

Any advice?

https://www.myheritage.com/research/record-1-171723521-1-16107/nanc... Shows her as Sequoyah’s daughter by Anna Swaney and fills in some dates. There are living descendants in this tree.

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https://www.familysearch.org/tree/person/details/GXCB-J1C

This is an educated guess. Nancy Sagaha Blackbird and Nancy Guess Blackbird have virtually identical records, children and spouses. Since she is known on the Cherokee Nation Census as Nancy Sa-ga-ha Blackbird, this may be one and the same person.

Oklahoma and Indian Territory, U.S., Dawes Census Cards for Five Civilized Tribes, 1898-1914 for William Blackbird
Cherokee By Blood
01345-01482

By her own words, her parents were George Guess (d 1860) & Anna Sawney.

www.geni.com/media/proxy?media_id=6000000191814261822&size=large

Nancy Blackbird in the Oklahoma and Indian Territory, Indian and Pioneer Historical Collection, 1937

Name: Nancy Blackbird
Birth Date: 1851
Birth Place: Stilwell, Oklahoma
Interview Date: 31 May 1937
Residence Place: USA

https://www.ancestry.com/sharing/1773966?mark=94bb47be563bdeb305455...

"and several grandchildren"

So who was the George Guess who died in 1860?

No one by that name on any list I've seen. Sequoyah told people he had twenty children, but that only ten survived. Starr lists Teesee, George, Polly, Richard, E-ya-gu,(Ayoka), Oo-loo-tsa, and Gu--y-ne-ki. Sally Waters Guess is on the Old Settler with two more, Lucinda and Susie. They were all born before 1840 and all died before the Dawes.

According to Nancy Blackbird's Eastern app she was born in 1860, the daughter of a man named George Guess, a different man from Sequoyah and probably unrelated. Sequoyah's son George had a daughter named Nancy but she is not this woman - that Nancy died in 1879. Nancy Blackbird was not an Old Settler and the Guess family all were. Nancy Blackbird's mother and grandparents all had only Cherokee names and people knew Nancy by a Cherokee name. Nancy was born in 1860. She is not listed as anyone's heir on the Old Settler Payroll.

I don't think anyone knows who Sallie Water's parents were. That's one of Hicks' inventions.

As a tree builder, I want to share this will add children to her family group: https://www.ancestry.com/sharing/1774756?mark=6d8124b8b16665dc7770d...

stepping away.
They lived in Sequoya and that may have led to some confusion, my input

The Nancy Blackbird on the Pioneer Papers interview is the woman on the Dawes, mother of William Blackbird, Grandmother of Ava Vann. On her Eastern App she said that her father died in 1877 but his half-sister Lydia said he died in 1861. The mother of Lydia and George was a woman named "Uk-tee-yah" according to the Drennan Roll but "Go-da-gar-we" according to Nancy Blackbird. Her father IS listed on the Drennan Roll as "George Guess" but I don't think there is any connection to Sequoyah. I think her father is a man who liked the idea of "George Guess" as an English name. It was common for people to just pick a random English name.

On her Dawes card her father is listed as George Packinghog, but I’m presuming he’s the same person she called George Guess?

www.geni.com/media/proxy?media_id=6000000191815312821&size=large

And whoever she was, she was NOT a daughter of Sequoyah who died almost twenty years before she was born.

Starr does not have her listed either. Her date of birth 1851 would better fit with the George Guess who was son of Ti Si Guess. I haven’t got down that far yet but with this birth dat3 could very well have living relatives. I think definitely not daughter of Sequoyah, I don’t find her name in anything I’ve read so far. I think this is a connection to the wrong George Guess.

Also no research on Sequoyah shows a wife named Anna Sawney. The likely 5 he had have been pretty much identified.

BTW I don’t have an ancestry acct so hit a pay wall trying to see that whole interview.

A number of profiles on MyHeritage have her married to Joseph U-Wa-Su-Tli VANN b. but born as a Packinghog

She also shows up in 1910, 1920 and 1930 census as living in Sequoyah County, Oklahoma, this could be where the connection to the name Sequoyah comes from.

There is also an entry for a Nancy Guess who married Joseph Blackbird, so if George Guess (III) as he’s been labeled had a daughter Nancy, then …

Yes, I think George "Packinghog" is the same man as her father "George Guess."

She is not a daughter of Sequoyah's son George. That is not the same man. His daughter Nancy is a totally different woman who died in 1879.

The Pioneer Papers interview is attached as a document:

https://www.geni.com/documents/view?doc_id=6000000191813865830

The 2nd page is just about games played, and the telephone arriving in 1886.

I’ve just been able to connect her tree to the World Family tree so it will be easier to work with.

I’d like to identify Cornelius Vann

This might help

https://www.ancestry.com/1940-census/usa/Oklahoma/Nancy-Blackbird_3....

This Nancy has a birth 1852 and was 88 in the 1950 census

Yes, I think we have this Nancy Blackbird squared away now.

Cornelius Vann was Cherokee; he was the son of Caroline Downing and Josiah Vann.

Can we further check that Squa-te-lah ‘Joe’ Blackbird had these parents?

Joseph Blackbird in the U.S., Civil War Pension Index: General Index to Pension Files, 1861-1934 < AncestrySharing > Name: Joseph Blackbird Relation to Head: Child Father: William Blackbird Mother: Anna Blackbird

https://www.ancestry.com/family-tree/person/tree/5621559/person/700... Shows JOHN & Anna Blackbird.

I’ve gone through Joe Blackbird in the Eastern Cherokee Applications of the U.S. Court of Claims, 1906-1909 < Fold3 >; (document attached) 1860 - birth of Sah-ho-yah (Nancy Blackbird) (page 4) (document attached); siblings & ancestors of Nancy Blackbird (page 5) (document attached). “Remarks: my name is Nancy Blackbird and I have a sister named Nancy Charles. Sisters very frequently bear the same name.”

The Cherokee names & relationships could use double checking, if anyone is so inclined,

I’ve also made Nancy a Master profile because she had a same-name sister.

Joseph - Sa ga ha - Blackbird the husband of Nancy was the son of Will and Anna according to both his Dawes app and the Civil War pension document. He was born after the Drennan, but his mother, father, and siblings are all there: William B Bird, Anne B. Bird, Wer cher char, Cul cher te he, and Che yor ker. Skin Bayou Family #100. Here's the link to Joe's Eastern app: https://www.fold3.com/image/223063264 and the Drennan Roll: https://www.ancestry.com/discoveryui-content/view/213055:8810?tid=&...

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